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                <h1 class="css-twhgrd">The Scourge of Agriculture</h1>
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                  <div class="css-7kp13n">By</div>
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                                          <a
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href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0865476225/theatlanticmonthA/ref=nosim"><i>Against
                                              the Grain</i></a> <br>
                                          [Click the title <br>
                                          to buy this book] by Richard
                                          Manning <br>
                                          North Point Press <br>
                                          <p> 232 pages, $24.</p>
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                                  <p>The concept of the noble savage has
                                    existed in the nomenclature of
                                    Western civilization for some time.
                                    In popular culture, the phrase may
                                    conjure up images of American
                                    Indians from movies like <i>Dances
                                      with Wolves</i>, or aborigines
                                    from <i>The Gods Must Be Crazy</i>.
                                    A roughly clad native runs around
                                    the bush with a bow and arrow,
                                    living a simple life that is best
                                    described as "close to nature." But
                                    where exactly does our conception of
                                    tribal peoples as inherently "noble"
                                    come from? And is it accurate?</p>
                                  <p>Richard Manning, who has written
                                    extensively about culture,
                                    agriculture, and the environment,
                                    believes that "noble savage" isn't a
                                    particularly satisfying way to
                                    describe tribal peoples. "It's more
                                    complicated than that," he says.
                                    However, in his new book, <i>Against
                                      the Grain: How Agriculture
                                      Hijacked Civilization</i>, he
                                    makes the case that
                                    tribes—particularly hunter-gatherer
                                    tribes—live in a way that is
                                    fundamentally sustainable, whereas
                                    the social system that developed
                                    with the advent of agriculture has
                                    spawned inequality and famine, and
                                    has had an immense environmental
                                    impact in a period of time (about
                                    10,000 years) that pales in
                                    comparison to the history of human
                                    life on the planet (about 4 million
                                    years). While arguments against
                                    agriculture have gained steam in the
                                    past few decades, they have centered
                                    mostly on the debate over
                                    twentieth-century developments like
                                    the Green Revolution or genetically
                                    modified crops. Manning's scope is
                                    much broader than that, and extends
                                    to the very origin of agricultural
                                    societies. He argues that a major
                                    change took place among humans when
                                    we discovered agriculture—and began
                                    to move toward an ethos of dominance
                                    based on the practice of
                                    domestication. </p>
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                                  <p>"Domestication is a human-driven
                                    evolution," Manning writes, "a
                                    fundamental shift in which human
                                    selection exerts enough pressure on
                                    the wild plant that it is visibly
                                    and irreversibly changed, its genes
                                    altered." Paradoxically, Manning
                                    explains, domestication helped
                                    create a society that was even more
                                    affected by the vagaries of nature
                                    than hunter-gatherer societies. This
                                    is because the kind of agriculture
                                    we came to practice was tied to a
                                    catastrophic relationship with the
                                    earth: the clearing of large tracts
                                    of land to put a single crop under
                                    till. That practice began to destroy
                                    diversity—the fundamental strength
                                    of all natural systems.</p>
                                  <p>In <i>Against the Grain</i>,
                                    Manning looks beyond the
                                    environmental effects of agriculture
                                    and civilization, which have already
                                    been well documented, and explores
                                    what these inventions have done to
                                    the quality of human life on the
                                    planet. Agriculture gave us surplus,
                                    surplus gave us wealth, and wealth
                                    gave us hierarchies that necessarily
                                    created an underclass. "If we are to
                                    seek ways in which humans differ
                                    from all other species, this
                                    dichotomy [between rich and poor]
                                    would head the list," Manning
                                    writes. "Evolution does not equip us
                                    to deal with abundance." The
                                    industrial agriculture showcased in
                                    twentieth-century America—fueled by
                                    government subsidy and the "dumping"
                                    of surplus grain in foreign markets
                                    and characterized by the shift
                                    toward processed food—has resulted
                                    in the obesity of the developed
                                    world and the malnutrition of the
                                    developing one. Readers may find
                                    Manning's proposed solutions to the
                                    problems caused by agriculture to be
                                    surprising. While one might expect
                                    him to encourage civilization to
                                    abandon agriculture in favor of
                                    something more "noble," in this
                                    interview he suggests that we should
                                    embrace it. In fact, the key to
                                    combating the problems we've created
                                    through agriculture lies in
                                    utilizing the very environmental
                                    manipulations we've relied on to
                                    domesticate our environment—but in
                                    different ways.</p>
                                  <br>
                                  <p><b>I found your subtitle, "How
                                      agriculture hijacked
                                      civilization," to be a bit
                                      confusing, given that you seem to
                                      be saying that agriculture and
                                      civilization are basically
                                      synonymous. Can you explain what
                                      you meant? </b></p>
                                  <p>Actually, I agree with you.
                                    However, there's an interesting
                                    caveat to that: we always think that
                                    agriculture allowed sedentism, which
                                    gave people time to create
                                    civilization and art. But the
                                    evidence that's emerging from the
                                    archeological record suggests that
                                    sedentism came first, and <i>then</i>
                                    agriculture. This occurred near
                                    river mouths, where people depended
                                    on seafood, especially salmon. These
                                    were probably enormously abundant
                                    cultures that had an enormous amount
                                    of leisure time—they just had to
                                    wait for the salmon runs to occur.
                                    There are some good records of those
                                    communities, and from the skeleton
                                    remains we can see that they got up
                                    to 95 percent of their nutrients
                                    from salmon and ocean-derived
                                    sources. Along the way, they
                                    developed highly refined
                                    art—something we always associate
                                    with agriculture. </p>
                                </section>
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                                <section>
                                  <p><b>The discovery of agriculture,
                                      you write, led to a shift in the
                                      way we interacted with our
                                      environment, toward an ethos of
                                      "dominance." It's hard not to
                                      envision agriculture as something
                                      that reflects an inherent drive
                                      within man to defeat, or at least
                                      tame, nature. But you also argue
                                      that the development of
                                      agriculture was just
                                      "opportunism." Does agriculture
                                      come from a desire to dominate, or
                                      was it just one big coincidence? </b></p>
                                  <p>We can approach that from about
                                    fifty different angles and not come
                                    up with a satisfactory answer. But I
                                    think it's really illuminating to
                                    think in these terms. One view is to
                                    say that all the damage we see on
                                    the planet is the result of our
                                    numbers, and of human nature—and
                                    that agriculture is the worst
                                    symptom of the human condition,
                                    because it has the greatest impact
                                    on the planet. In this analysis, we
                                    don't blame agriculture—we blame
                                    humans.</p>
                                  <p>But I don't think that's the full
                                    explanation. This gets a lot richer
                                    when you look at co-evolution: it's
                                    not just human genes at work here.
                                    It's wheat genes and corn genes—and
                                    how they have an influence on us.
                                    They took advantage of our ability
                                    to travel, our inventiveness, our
                                    ability to use tools, to live in a
                                    broad number of environments, and
                                    our huge need for carbohydrates.
                                    Because of our brains' ability, we
                                    were able to spread not only our
                                    genes, but wheat's genes as well.
                                    That's why I make the argument that
                                    you have to look at this in terms of
                                    wheat domesticating us, too. That
                                    co-evolutionary process between
                                    humans and our primary food crops is
                                    what created the agriculture we see
                                    today.</p>
                                  <p><b> The biggest problem with
                                      agriculture—and civilization—seems
                                      to be the surplus it creates. You
                                      make the point in the book that
                                      humans have not developed a way of
                                      dealing with surplus yet. Do you
                                      think we ever will?</b></p>
                                  <p>Since civilization began, surplus
                                    has been with us. A kind of "blind
                                    need for excess" has been driving
                                    our culture in exactly the wrong
                                    direction. It creates stratified
                                    societies. The CEO of a corporation
                                    makes a thousand times more than one
                                    of his workers. That kind of
                                    disparity doesn't exist in any other
                                    type of species. And that would
                                    suggest that we haven't gotten any
                                    better at handling surplus—in fact
                                    we've gotten worse at it. </p>
                                  <p>Dealing with surplus is a difficult
                                    task. The problem begins with the
                                    fact that, just like the sex drive,
                                    the food drive got ramped up in
                                    evolution. If you have a deep,
                                    yearning need for food, you're going
                                    to get along better than your
                                    neighbor, and over the years that
                                    gene is going to be passed on. So
                                    you get this creature that got
                                    fine-tuned to really need food,
                                    especially carbohydrates. Which
                                    brings us to the more fundamental
                                    question: can we ever deal with
                                    sugar? By making more concentrated
                                    forms of carbohydrates, we're
                                    playing into something that's quite
                                    addictive and powerful. It's why
                                    we're so blasted obese. We have
                                    access to all this sugar, and we
                                    simply cannot control our need for
                                    it—that's genetic. </p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
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                                <section>
                                  <p>Now, can we gain the ability to
                                    overcome that? I'm not sure. You
                                    have to add to this the fact that
                                    there's a lot of money to be made by
                                    people who know how to concentrate
                                    sugar. They have a real interest in
                                    seeing that we don't overcome these
                                    kinds of addictions. In fact, that's
                                    how you control societies—you
                                    exploit that basic drive for food.
                                    That's how we train dogs—if you want
                                    to make a dog behave properly, you
                                    deprive him or give him food. Humans
                                    aren't that much different. We just
                                    like to think we are. So as an
                                    element of political control, food
                                    and food imagery are enormously
                                    important.</p>
                                  <p><b>What about religious control? If
                                      agriculture creates surplus, which
                                      creates social hierarchies, then
                                      how has religion affected that?</b></p>
                                  <p>The control of an enormous supply
                                    of food was woven heavily into
                                    religious observance. In the early
                                    going of agriculture, it was the
                                    priest who decided when the planting
                                    would occur, and all the religious
                                    observances were geared to seasonal
                                    changes. It's all woven into a very
                                    rich story—it's even in our prayers:
                                    "Give us this day our daily bread."</p>
                                  <p>But religion also gets into display
                                    behavior. Part of that is the
                                    self-denial that goes with religious
                                    observance. People fast because it's
                                    the opposite of what normal people
                                    would do, so it's a display of
                                    fealty. And though I don't mean to
                                    disparage vegetarians, we've all
                                    seen that kind of display behavior
                                    there, too: the vegetarian who
                                    orders very loudly in a restaurant
                                    so that everyone knows he is morally
                                    superior in some way.</p>
                                  <p><b>That's interesting. Do you think
                                      vegetarianism isn't as socially
                                      responsible as it's cracked up to
                                      be?</b></p>
                                  <p>It depends on how it's done. In the
                                    U.S., we use highly processed foods
                                    as replacements. You know, rice
                                    cream and soy burgers and all that
                                    stuff. Once you're into that kind of
                                    process, then the energy gains from
                                    vegetarianism are almost immediately
                                    removed. But beyond that, you have
                                    to look at the way we do agriculture
                                    in the U.S. We wipe out enormous
                                    areas of habitat. Iowa has something
                                    less than 1 percent of its native
                                    habitat left. Well, that habitat
                                    supported wild animals. So you have
                                    a hard time arguing for
                                    vegetarianism as some kind of
                                    "kindness to animals" when you're
                                    wiping out their entire habitat that
                                    way. </p>
                                  <p><b>If agriculture and civilization
                                      have caused so many problems, what
                                      about hunter-gatherers? Does their
                                      way of life work better?</b></p>
                                  <p>Let's consider what happened in
                                    America. When European settlers came
                                    here, it became a very active policy
                                    of the government to try to make
                                    Indians start farming. Thomas
                                    Jefferson was explicit in that, and
                                    he wasn't alone. But the Indians
                                    simply fled—and not only did they
                                    leave white agriculture, but they
                                    left their own agriculture. Once
                                    they had horses, they had the option
                                    to hunt a lot more effectively. They
                                    put down their hoes, got on their
                                    horses, went into the western
                                    plains, and became nomadic in places
                                    that hadn't seen anyone for years.
                                    They became hunters. Did they
                                    "figure something out," or did they
                                    cut a deal with nature that was
                                    somehow sustainable? No, it's more
                                    complicated than that, because as
                                    soon as market hunting came into the
                                    area and allowed them to sell bison
                                    robes to the whites, they actually
                                    participated in the extinction of
                                    the bison—even before white hunters
                                    were on the scene. </p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <section>
                                  <p><b>But even that practice was a
                                      result of their contact with
                                      civilization.</b></p>
                                  <p>And ability. So once given the
                                    technology, the market, and the
                                    ability to exploit that resource in
                                    a different way, they simply took
                                    advantage of it. </p>
                                  <p><b>So is there something that
                                      civilization can learn from the
                                      tribal way of life?</b></p>
                                  <p>Yes, I think there is something
                                    really important that
                                    hunter-gatherer cultures learned
                                    that we could benefit from. It's the
                                    fundamental idea of insecurity. We
                                    trade an enormous amount of freedom
                                    in our society for security. That's
                                    always the trade-off. It is our
                                    inability to deal with our lack of
                                    control over how and when we die
                                    that is fundamentally responsible
                                    for all of this. So we give up a lot
                                    of freedom for the false assurances
                                    that we won't die in this way or
                                    that way. I think we can learn from
                                    the hunter-gatherers that that's
                                    really an illusion. That kind of
                                    security is not obtainable in a
                                    natural system—and we are in a
                                    natural system and always will be.
                                    Therefore, we need to accept a good
                                    deal of that instability and threat
                                    and danger in our lives.</p>
                                  <p><b>Seems like a tough sell.</b></p>
                                  <p>Yes, it is. It's absolutely a tough
                                    sell. I mean, you look at how people
                                    sell cars today, it's, "This car
                                    won't kill you"—they don't care
                                    about anything else. Forget the gas
                                    mileage. And look what we're willing
                                    to give up in this country in terms
                                    of civil liberties, for instance,
                                    just because of the threat of
                                    terrorism. You cannot change the
                                    reality that the world is a
                                    dangerous place. So it is an
                                    illusion to think that we can be
                                    secure. We would be much better off
                                    if we'd simply give up that illusion
                                    and say, "I am going to die, I could
                                    die at any moment—now I'm going to
                                    get on with enjoying life."</p>
                                  <p><b>I wonder what it might take to
                                      return to that worldview? In
                                      nature, when a species adopts an
                                      unsustainable practice, nature
                                      eventually bites back with a
                                      catastrophe, like a population
                                      crash. Is that what it will take
                                      for humans to change the way we
                                      produce food?</b></p>
                                  <p>People always say, "Well, if
                                    there's some terrible catastrophe, <i>then</i>
                                    we'll learn." But the catastrophe is
                                    already here. Africa is a
                                    catastrophe. Asia, Latin America…
                                    The poorest places in the world are
                                    constantly experiencing these very
                                    things that we envision as being
                                    disastrous. </p>
                                  <p><b>But not in America.</b></p>
                                  <p>No, not in America. So far, we're
                                    comfortably able to keep it out of
                                    sight. That's why we don't read
                                    international news in this country,
                                    that's why it doesn't show up on our
                                    TV sets—because we are able to
                                    maintain some sort of denial about
                                    the fact that one third of humanity
                                    lives on less than a dollar a day.
                                    We've separated ourselves. It's all
                                    around us—we just simply ignore it.
                                  </p>
                                  <p><b>In what ways will the First
                                      World "feel the rub" of the
                                      problems that stem from industrial
                                      agriculture?</b></p>
                                  <p>I think the effects of global
                                    warming are going to ramp up in the
                                    next fifteen to twenty years.
                                    There's going to be widespread crop
                                    failure because of global warming,
                                    that's pretty clear. And there are
                                    going to be huge weather changes and
                                    increased wildfires. </p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <section>
                                  <p><b>Some might claim that
                                      free-market capitalism is the best
                                      way to create more egalitarian
                                      civilizations. It's tempting to
                                      view the free-market as the
                                      closest societal reflection of
                                      nature's "survival of the
                                      fittest." What do you think?</b></p>
                                  <p>Capitalism is a very linear
                                    process—we build factories with it.
                                    It doesn't think in terms of
                                    complexity, and it certainly doesn't
                                    accept insecurity. This gets us back
                                    to the fundamentals of agriculture.
                                    It's a factory system, a linear
                                    system. We think of inputs, outputs,
                                    and a single crop. </p>
                                  <p>Nature doesn't work that way. The
                                    promise of nature is something
                                    called "over-yielding," the whole
                                    being greater than the sum of its
                                    parts. That's why I value natural
                                    systems so greatly. They work in
                                    combination with a lot of different
                                    things, and when those things are
                                    together and finely tuned, they tend
                                    to produce more than whatever we
                                    could replace them with. For
                                    example, prairies provide their own
                                    fertilizer. </p>
                                  <p>Co-evolution comes up with
                                    solutions to problems that are much
                                    better than what we could come up
                                    with. So in that way it's unlike how
                                    we've conceived of capitalism.</p>
                                  <p><b>You write that solutions to
                                      industrial agriculture's problems
                                      aren't going to come from the
                                      government, since the very idea of
                                      government sprouted from
                                      agricultural civilizations. Are
                                      there ways we can apply our
                                      understanding of nature to current
                                      society?</b></p>
                                  <p>Well, there are some hopeful things
                                    out there. We're already beginning
                                    to accommodate our understanding of
                                    nature into information technology.
                                    When we start playing around with
                                    things like artificial intelligence,
                                    for instance, we know that we have
                                    to deal with complexity and that we
                                    have to design these organic systems
                                    that look like nature. </p>
                                  <p>But the big steps come from
                                    understanding the genome. That gives
                                    us an incredible appreciation of
                                    nature, and also the ability to
                                    harness the productivity of nature
                                    in unique ways.</p>
                                  <p><b>Like how?</b></p>
                                  <p>For example, when you go to your
                                    local health-food store, you see two
                                    kinds of beets—golden and striped.
                                    This happened because some people
                                    were looking at some wild relatives
                                    and natural mutations in beets, and
                                    they found that there were two genes
                                    that created the red color in beets,
                                    and if they switched one off (not
                                    using genetic engineering, but a
                                    simple "knock-out"), it became
                                    striped. It turns out that this
                                    variation codes for a chemical
                                    called betalin, which is a
                                    cancer-fighting agent. So by
                                    understanding the manipulation of
                                    this gene, and by putting more
                                    betalin in the beet, they ramped up
                                    that cancer-fighting ability. If we
                                    look more into "forgotten" crops,
                                    and also wild relatives of crops,
                                    there are all these pigments that
                                    are coded for in genes. And these
                                    genes have many disease-fighting
                                    capabilities that we have bred out
                                    of our plants. We can bring those
                                    back into our crops quite easily and
                                    rapidly with the technology we have.</p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <section>
                                  <p><b>At the same cost to the
                                      consumer?</b></p>
                                  <p>Yes, absolutely the same. The
                                    breeder I know who did this in
                                    Wisconsin says it's so easy that he
                                    doesn't have to deal with seed
                                    companies. In the "old world" you
                                    had to work with seed companies, and
                                    the seed company had to recover its
                                    investment—therefore things were
                                    expensive. But he can do it very
                                    quickly, release it to organic
                                    farmers, and then go on growing the
                                    thing—and it's a free seed. </p>
                                  <p><b> That's interesting. I think my
                                      first reaction whenever I hear
                                      about manipulations of nature is a
                                      negative one. In your book,
                                      though, you point out that even
                                      something as basic as using
                                      fire—something tribal societies
                                      did and still do—is a manipulation
                                      of nature. And here you seem to be
                                      lobbying for more manipulation.</b></p>
                                  <p>They're just wiser manipulations.
                                    One of the fundamental principles
                                    here is that these manipulations are
                                    not guided so much by our
                                    imaginations as by what existed
                                    before—that collective wisdom of
                                    nature. So we're going back and
                                    looking at the broader, more complex
                                    genes that we ignored before and
                                    saying, "What's in here that we
                                    didn't know?" The principle here is
                                    humility. We are not able to imagine
                                    the ultimate solutions—we have to
                                    see what nature has already imagined
                                    and mimic that.</p>
                                  <p><b>The solutions you speak of seem
                                      to have an awful lot to do with
                                      organic and alternative farming.
                                      That's fine for the hipster in
                                      Manhattan who can afford the whole
                                      foods store, or the farmer in
                                      Minnesota who can grow organic
                                      corn in fertile soil, but what
                                      about those who live in poverty?
                                      In your book, you chronicle the
                                      oppression of the poor by
                                      agricultural civilizations. What
                                      hope is there for them now? </b></p>
                                  <p>I know of a project in India which
                                    is an interesting case because
                                    India, like most other poor
                                    countries, is so heavily dependent
                                    on rice. But in India, it turns out
                                    that the poorest of the poor are
                                    dependent on dry-land rice. Ît's
                                    kind of a weird concept; it's not
                                    irrigated. Something like 40 percent
                                    of the land area given over to rice
                                    in the world is dry-land rice. The
                                    poor depend on it for a reason: they
                                    can't afford the best land, they
                                    can't afford irrigation, so they get
                                    by on the very marginal stuff, and
                                    have for thousands of years. </p>
                                  <p>Of course, science for the last
                                    thirty or forty years has been
                                    looking intensively at irrigated
                                    rice, because such rice offers the
                                    most bang for the buck. But there
                                    are a couple of researchers in
                                    Bangalore, India, who've been
                                    collecting the local varieties of
                                    dry-land rice that people grow in
                                    those poor communities. They then
                                    compared them against the very best
                                    "improved" varieties from the very
                                    best of science, and they found out
                                    that the local varieties were
                                    better. They always yielded—no
                                    matter how bad the conditions
                                    were—and they had certain
                                    nutritional values that the other
                                    varieties didn't have. </p>
                                  <p>So they're cataloguing the genomes
                                    of all these wild varieties, and
                                    breeding those varieties with the
                                    best characteristics into a variety
                                    of rice that, while very close to
                                    their local ones, also has some of
                                    the disease-resistant and
                                    insect-resistant capabilities of the
                                    improved varieties. In other words,
                                    they're making a "super local"
                                    variety. And then they're turning it
                                    back over to these poor people for
                                    free. It's an interesting case where
                                    people are thinking of ways to use
                                    technology to intervene for the
                                    poor.</p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <div>
                              <div>
                                <section>
                                  <p><b>But isn't improving yield just
                                      creating more food, which in turn
                                      creates more people? </b></p>
                                  <p>That's a fascinating question—if
                                    you look at population growth in the
                                    world, it occurs not only in the
                                    most agricultural places on the
                                    globe, but also in the poorest
                                    places. Population growth is going
                                    crazy in places like India, Africa,
                                    and Southeast Asia. You have to find
                                    ways to ramp up the income of the
                                    poorest just slightly, because the
                                    record is very clear that if we can
                                    improve their income, their
                                    birthrate goes down dramatically.
                                    I've seen it. I was in a village in
                                    Mexico where one farmer was making
                                    something like 15 percent more than
                                    his neighbor, and he had two kids
                                    while his neighbor had thirteen.
                                    That's a very common thing in the
                                    developing world. Birth rate is most
                                    closely related to the income of the
                                    family—and that's true worldwide.
                                    The better your income, the fewer
                                    kids you tend to have. Education is
                                    also important, especially amongst
                                    women. If you can educate women,
                                    then birth control comes into play a
                                    lot more easily, and they have
                                    options to exercise. Good
                                    agriculture is hugely important in
                                    getting this to happen—but not
                                    industrial agriculture, which just
                                    makes it worse. If we're able to
                                    intervene, we have to understand
                                    that if we do agriculture well,
                                    we'll make lives better. But if we
                                    do it badly, we're going to make
                                    them worse.</p>
                                </section>
                              </div>
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